This is going to get heated, but we, as a community, MUST address this RIGHT NOW.
“Is it ever okay to copy your competitors?”
Before you share your thoughts in the comments, let me set the stage…
The Two Types Of Copying
There are two types of copying. One is just smart business, and the other is just straight up stupid. Let’s talk about ‘em both.
When Copying Is Good For Business
There are two specific scenarios where I believe copying your competitors is one of the smartest business moves you can make.
#1 The Drafting Technique
A few months ago I revealed what I call the drafting technique. For those of you who are unfamiliar with it, here’s the short of it:
When you’re looking to score major media, whether you’re trying to get in the newspaper or on a huge blog, the best way to do it is by “drafting” behind your competitors.
What’s drafting? Figure out where your competitors have been featured, and find the hook that allows you to get featured too.
For example, as Pinterest was on the rise, I was talking to the guys over at Gentlemint (the pinterest for men) and I told them that they should reach out to every newspaper reporter that covers Pinterest and pitch Gentlemint for men as a potential follow-up article.
Pinterest was hot, and this was a simple and easy for for Gentlemint to land major media with journalists simply because journalists LOVE stories just like that.
#2 Make Something Better
The other type of copying is less about copying, and more about improving what already exists.
As an example, A Malcolm Gladwell article referred to Steve Jobs as a “Tweaker.”
The reality was, Steve Jobs didn’t invent anything. Instead, he simply found what existed, and made it much better and more user friendly.
To me, this is completely okay.
Improving what exists is a proven way to make a splash within a community. It’s also a great way to build a remarkable and sustainable business that people LOVE.
But There’s A Time When Copying Is Dumb…
…And earlier today, I stumbled on a PERFECT example of it.
Take a look at these two screenshots:
Screenshot #1: Crazy Egg (a heat mapping service that I’ve recommended in the past)
Screenshot #2: Click Tale (a competing heat mapping service)
Update: Clicktale has since remove this page from their website. They’re still one of my favorite services for heat mapping software, and I’m glad they chose to do the right thing.
The design… the copy… the Johnson box… EVERYTHING… appears to be an exact replica.
(For those of you wondering, a Johnson box is that little “What you’ll discover on this page” box).
And based on Neil Patel’s (one of the founders of Crazy Egg) latest tweet, it appears Clicktale copied Crazy Egg.
To me, if Clicktale really did copy Crazy Egg, that’s the dumbest they could have done.
Even if Crazy Egg’s design converts brass into gold… copying it word-for-word is stupid for two reasons:
First, people WILL find out. And when they do, articles like this one will be published
(Plus, if you’re a heat mapping company, why are you copying a rival’s website? Shouldn’t your software allow you to create your own innovative designs?)
Second, it’s just the WRONG thing to do. There’s no way that anyone can justify this as “morally okay in my book.”
But Now I Want To Pass This To You…
When is it okay for a company to copy their competitors?
Be as specific as possible, and if you’ve ever been ripped off by a competitor, share your story in the comments
(One note: Please refrain from mentioning specific company names. Keep it to the story and the industry you’re involved in)
Also, I’d like to get as many stories as possible, so if you can please share this on Twitter, it would be great.
“When is it okay to copy your competitors?” – Click to Tweet
{ 157 comments… read them below or add one }
Don’t we have copyright laws to help us settle the matter?
Upholding copyright laws for creative work is so tricky. In fashion, for example, Christian Louboutin’s signature high heel design had a red sole. Then every fast-fashion establishment copied him. He tried to fight back but lost his case. :/ I can kind of see both sides.
Some people argue that the copyright-less environment is why fashion has such an innovative landscape– because it’s the only way to survive as a high-end designer. I mean, in the end, Forever 21 will never have the clout (or price tag) of Christian Louboutin.
It’s very hard to fight back copyright infringement. And in this case, while this is a battle between two companies, when it’s a battle between two small companies or individuals, it gets even harder… and mor expensive.
i’m sure it is very difficult…just like it’s difficult for musicians to make money from their tunes thanks to people stealing songs…but we still have the laws to tell us what at least the government thinks is right and wrong…of course morals and ethics aren’t the same, but it’s a start for a very complicated problem that probably deserves a weightier response than a comment or even a blog post…unless it was a really, really, realllllly long blog post that no one would read haha
Tyler, I see your point, but I need to disagree on two fronts.
1) While musicians/creatives do and should hold he copyright to their content, it’s a lack of serving the market in the way in which it wants to be served that is causing the stealing of music. I can torrent any movie I want to, but instead I pay netflix. Why? Because it’s easier and they have several things I like.
Bands/Musicians should see their content as a means of marketing themselves as a brand and draw revenue from other streams, such as merch, limited box-sets, selling vinyl WITH the mp3′s, etc.
Telephone booths got replaced because of a more convenient (and more expensive) technology. Innovative musicians who know business do just fine.
2) Morals and Ethics are, in fact, the same thing. Morals comes from the latin and Ethics comes from greek. They define the same term.
1) just because musicians SHOULD realize that doesn’t give someone the right to decide that FOR them in this way.
2) they did indeed have the same origins, but they split and meanings change over the years. we really don’t have to get into that any further though, this isn’t a course in who can google what haha.
Agreed on #1 – It does not give the right to steal — though there is a huge missed opportunity and a lot of complaining.
#2 – disagree (or agree to disagree). We went pretty deeply into the language origins in my Ethics class back in college (before I ditched the philosophy major). People may use them differently, but they do in fact mean the same thing.
I think my first reply about how I was plagiarized 15 times, WIRD FOR WORD, didn’t make it through your filters because I gave the sites.
Philip Leo Kraus. All you need. After you search my name, then look for my article “Shopping In Tough Times” on Associated Content (now Yahoo Voices) and then use a good plag checker and most of the rips will show.
My music is also being sold as ringtones and given away free as MP3′s and a book i wrote was reworded and posted.
It’s so discouraging that these rateros go around ripping people off and are seemingly doing better than us!
Not sure what you’re referring to. But it seems like content is always lifted whole-sale. Especially blog content.
But when a large company does it, it’s strange.
1. There is a HUGE difference between using something as a model and ripping it off.
When you use someone elses model, you allow your own content and product to stand out. You have your own brand, it may be similar, but it is not a knock off of the “competition.”
There is a company that views me as “competition” they regularly attempt to copy (rip off) my classes and programs. They are not as successful, because they can’t be me. I’m the attractant in my membership service. So, I don’t worry about them much at all really, other than if I find out they have violated my copyright we’re gonna chat.
2. Ripping off copy and design is COPYRIGHT THEFT. Anyone who steals copy written material should be hunted down like the dogs they are. Nuff said.
FYI regarding copyright and the internet: http://www.roniloren.com/blog/2012/7/20/bloggers-beware-you-can-get-sued-for-using-pics-on-your-blog.html
I’m all for modeling. Modeling is a great way to learn. Modeling is how you can take what exists and get better. When you model someone and make it better, you’er officially a Tweaker and that’s okay in my book.
Whole-sale theft sucks though.
Ok, guys; what’s a Tweaker?
I agree about the modeling idea; I’m definitely looking at sites that I like for inspiration. Even things like page layout, what’s prominent, that sort of thing. I don’t consider it copying, as there is no negative impact on their business, or any impact at all.
Gross bulk copying is never OK. However, copying some, with attribution, is fine, particularly if you’re using it as a foundation for what additional value you’re going to be providing. For example, you interview Nancy Duarte. You used some of her quotes and copied some of her info, but you also a) attributed, b) threw traffic her way, and c) added additional information and value to it. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. Plagiarism is the sincerest form of laziness.
That interview is hardly considered copying…
That’s done as a way to shine the spotlight on the person you’re talking to. And if you quote someones book, the same applies.
However,r in this scenario, where you’re just lifting it because you think its going to work for your company too… that’s just stealing.
Curebit completely ripped off 37Signals’s Basecamp late last year: http://techcrunch.com/2012/01/28/curebit-apologizes-for-copying-37signals/
DHH got furious and out started a Twitter fight that was pretty entertaining to watch.
I remember that, heh.
I saw you tweet earlier comparing the two and was shocked. They made it blatantly obvious that their site structure was based off of Crazy Egg.
No originality or creativity at all…
That’s why I wrote about it.
It’s an interesting one because there is a fine line between copying and brand alignment.
Big fast food companies, for example, deliberately make themselves look as similar as possible with their menus and so on. They don’t want to appear different because they know that they are all marketing to the same population.
So when is brand alignment copying online? It’s a good question.
Ramsay
When you look at these two examples, that’s not brand alignment. That’s copying to me
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I was doing a mastermind group with some folks and shared the new direction my business was going in along with some of the methods I use.
Within two weeks I saw nearly the same thing done on a site hosted by someone from the group. My jaw dropped.
It was so ridiculously plagiarized I had to laugh.
But the funniest thing was that they were SO excited to share this “discovery” on the next call!
It was met with stark silence, and I just giggled.
I knew my product and know-how was and is why people chose to work with me, and they ultimately got some business out of it but with a group of people I really didn’t want to work with.
Win win.
That’s the problem with masterminds…
Never know who’s in it and what they’re capable of.
I’m in a new mastermind group online and was just about to run a new idea I had by them. After reading this I may have to reconsider and even cancel my membership.
Frankly, what good is a mastermind group without the open sharing of ideas?
Who do you run new ideas by? A personal coach? Any recommendations?
Not everyone is out to steal ideas…
Nick, see my comment below yours re Masterminds and a tip to watch out for – make sure your group signs off on confidentiality.
Personal coaches often have big mouths, make sure yours has high integrity training. My own coach pulled an idea from me ! ouch.
Kat, most credible masterminds include signing a document that all info revealed and shared must be held confidential. The leader is accountable. If there was a legal document, you may be interested in pursuing, if for no other reason than to discourage this kind of thing from happening to others.
I’ve participated (and led) many and never had this happen.
What is happening to the integrity of biz owners?????
Guess that’s one of the takeaways from Derek’s post, but also how foolish it is from a biz standpoint to blatently copy in the ‘wrong’ ways.
I hope that the good guys win the day, but unfortunately it doesn’t always work out that way.
It’s usually hard to enforce NDAs.
At this point, I have personally hand-selected folks that are not only successful, but have high levels of integrity. We are also in very different businesses, which seems to make a hell of a lot of sense…
I’ve seen a few DIY blog posts about our Cat Crib product. A huge and well known lady who does DIY for “good things” also did a video showing a similar item.
To tell you the truth, both of these situations probably helped us out. Both of the DIY posts ended up with products that didn’t function as well and also didn’t look as nice. I know in the past I’ve been frustrated after going the DIY route and ended up buying the regular product. I’m thinking the same will happen in this scenario. Also, if people are absolutely focused on making something themselves, they weren’t my target audience anyway.
That’s a good example of how it can help though. In this case, it looks like it was whole-sale copied, to me.
This is an issue I recently addressed after I had my images and content stolen. Fact is no one copies crap. However, the only person you are doing massive in justice to, when you copy someone else, is YOU.
Yes, emulate, steal (ideas) but make then yours!!! Add you opinion, your voice, your secret somethin’.
No one can be a better version of you. All those copycats just look like a crappy counterfeit of your brilliance.
Ideas aren’t born in a vacuum, it is ok, and ofter necessary, to have a muse but make it yours, and if you can’t attribute where the idea came from.
Ameena has nailed it on the head.
Thanks Rob – it’s really important to be true to yourself if you want to grow – I really wish more people got it!
I’m going to agree with Rob here. You nailed it.
People who copy do so because they aren’t capable or ar too lazy to come up with their own.
I work in accessories industry. In this industry people’s original ideas are ripped off all the time and mass produced in some sweat factory in the third word. And it is nigh impossible to stop them.
I take solace in the fact that I have plently of more good ideas to draw on where as copiers don’t have any.
I’ve heard that the accessory industry is RUTHLESS when it comes to copycats. Large copies jacking small company ideas, and the like.
First thins first. Ameena that was brilliant. You should write about it
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“Yes, emulate, steal (ideas) but make then yours!!! Add you opinion, your voice, your secret somethin’.”
Derek it’s funny because we were talking about this last night. I think it’s great that people are out there sharing their insights and ideas. But when people follow them to the letter at best they’ll get slightly above average results. But what Ameena is talking about comes down to one thing: Adaptation. That’s what your secret something is all about in my opinion.
Funny how that works, right? I wonder if that’s why I got all fired up about this today.
Thanks Srini and Derek – I get really upset when people copy others too – it sucks big time.
BTW – Srini – I do write about the issue of embracing you – a lot – people hiding behind others, copying, and basically selling themselves short is my biz nemesis!
Simple, NEVER!
If you can’t bring anything new to the table, you’re not working hard enough.
That’s not always true… sometimes you could be working too hard. In Imagine, by Jonah Lehrer, he talks about how working too hard can stifle creativity. Gotta let your mind rest.
To be fair to Clicktale they did use ‘amazing’ instead of ‘astonishing.’
I think you some how left that part out of the article lol.
Joking aside, I think you can copy some things, but not from the same website. For example, if someone is using a cool font you might send them an email and ask them what it is. Just because you like it and don’t know the name.
Then maybe someone uses a certain color for something you might like. So maybe you could add little things you find from different sites, but I’d say to make sure they are in different industries.
That’s sort of using someones good idea. Not blatantly copying them.
Clicktale have made a stupid error. That’s just stealing.
Like I said, I’m not sure what went down here. I saw a tweet from Neil, and I decided to write about it. I’ve personally dealt with some people who wholesale lift my ideas and it’s annoying.
Where does copying start? What about copying ideas? Let’s say you read books and take courses and use ideas and things you learned there in your own copy and information products, is this copying? I’m not talking about the exact same words for sure, but the idea will be the same.
You have to use your best judgment obviously. You can’t really copy ideas, but if you do take an idea from someone, it’s usually a good idea to give them credit for it.
Derek,
I had an INC 500 company take a popular blog post that I had written and simply paraphrase the content. They gave a very weak attribution and then linked to their competing service.
I contacted them and suggested they improve the attribution or take down the post. They chose to take down the post.
In most cases, this is a really interesting question. In such a crowded space, we all take the things that work (like your email list building suggestions) and learn from others mistakes.
However, this is blatant. Legal or not, I would not be comfortable doing business with a company that operated this way. I would rather go with the original.
In fact, it would be interesting to ask their showcase customers to comment on what they thought about the design. I’ll be interested to see how this plays out.
Great post!
Vince
Interesting little idea… I’m not about to go that far though, as that’s not my goal here. My goal is to just spark the discussion about copying
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I’m not suggesting you should go that far but I do think accountability is a necessary part of the process for copiers. I am realizing that in most cases it’s better to just ignore the unoriginal.
Another great post Derek. Two questions:
1. Okay to “plagiarize” if you’re in a different industry? e.g. using an example, a business process or template for nonprofit that worked well for for-profit company?
2. What’s a good response if you are copied? A former employer is copying my work and I’ve just remained quiet, but am wondering if I should do something?
I’m not sure how to respond honestly. If they’re straight up stealing, I think talking to them is probably best.
In the end, many people will have forgotten whose campaign was first. Perhaps it is poor comfort, but only good things are copied.
So you’re saying this is okay?
Good timing on the article, I received an alert through google alerts this morning with a trackback to my website. I followed to see what it was and it is a website under construction that is a carbon copy of my own, content and all! I couldn’t believe it.
I managed to get hold of their email and told them they need to remove the content.
They have informed me they are doing so but I had no reply about the design which is exactly the same down to the navigation, layout, product info details, even little bits of content encouraging people to comment are the same.
Problem is I don’t even know if there is anything I can do.
Took me over a year of tweaking to get my site the way I want it today!! Frustrating.
Should I just be happy if they take the content down or can I push further to try and get them to change the design?
If they stole your design, I think you need to tell them about that. And see what else you can do about it. A DMCA notice might be appropriate. I’m not sure exactly how to deal with this though.
Its NEVER ok to copy. However, it is ok to be influence by others; meaning seeing what they do and if it’s smart, adding your own twist to it. (ie: Think what Steve Jobs did when he created iPods)
I’ve been copied or as I like to call it, “swagger jacked”, several times. A few years ago, I was working to start blog & web TV show based around debating selected topics with a very specific name. There was a few people who was aware of the concept before its scheduled launch. A week or so before my launch I receive an email with a friend with a link to a website that basically mimicked my entire concept. Title, intro, angle, design, like everything. Once I saw that, I scrapped the project and took it on the chin as a loss.
Eh…
Ideas aren’t worth much nowadays. It’s the execution that matters.
But this is slightly different.
People will always copy competitors. Always. Social media is a perfect example. There are bloggers and others who follow people primarily to rip off ideas and thought patterns. Often you see people blog about topics they do not understand. They see a tweet and think to themselves that will make a good topic for my blog and they write the me too post without any real passion. Offline this happens all the time. I have see plenty of ideas ripped off over the years. Academia is another example. The fact is ideas build on the shoulders of other ideas. Individuals will always copy because they think it is easier than coming up with original thinking or concepts. I do not believe any idea is unique. We are conditioned by our environment but you can but your stamp on concept and make it your own. This is essentially what it means to be creative. I am from the Emerson school of insist on yourself. There is no problem with improving an idea in my opinion. But when you rip off ideas and do not put in the effort or work to make the idea better. It is lame and lazy shows a lack of character and respect. And in the end it will come back to bite you.
Can’t say I disagree with you here
It’s OK to copy if you get permission.
That’s deeper than it first looks I think.
‘cos if you’re thinking of copying something and you then think about getting permission from the person you’re copying but it feels weird – that’s a signal you should be copying.
Or put another way – if it became public knowledge you’d copied something, how would you feel? If you wouldn’t feel comfortable it’s another signal not to do it.
Ian
That’s a great point Ian. If it doesn’t feel right, it’s probably not right.
I think that drafting and tweaking are probably the only acceptable forms of copying….especially since both don’t really copy, they just make it better or different. I also think that properly “curating” content is OK too as long as proper credit is given.
A site that curates content WELL is Brainpickings. They don’t necessarily create, but curate, and it’s a perfect example of curation done right.
Imitation maybe the sincerest form of flattery, except of course, when it’s an exact copy. As you intimate, Derek, plagiarism is cheating and those who practice it deserve all they get.
Well said, Brian.
Of course, that should say “cos if you’re thinking of copying something and you then think about getting permission from the person you’re copying but it feels weird – that’s a signal you SHOULDN’T be copying”.
@derekhalpern it seems ClickTale is not the only one doing this, the folks at worryfreeagent.com also copied my site. Instead of publicly calling them out on it, I emailed them about it and called them. No one answered my calls or responded to my email but I noticed a day after my email, their site was down for maintenance for about a 2 weeks. I figured that they were changing stuff around, well they are back up with the same site design and even stole my copy word for word. Its really outragious when folks do stuff like this. Any ideas on what I can do?
Generally you don’t want to reward them with links to their site.
Sure it’s OK. There are a lot of good reasons to copy. The first is that you don’t have to re-invent the wheel. You mention Steve Jobs, Derek. Well, Thomas Edison comes to mind as well… and while we are at it, how about the Japanese or the ancient Greeks? Every single one of those examples shows tat it is possible to transcend stupid, mindless, copying through a process of assimilation followed by innovation.
It has been said that all learning begins with with mimicry.
That being said, the ethics suggest that it is a failure to give credit to one’s sources that will get you into trouble every time. In academics, it’s called “plagiarism.”
I should add that there is another element. Example: there is one particular website whose look and feel I love. Try as I might, I keep coming back to that inspirational design, but I don’t want to look like a rip-off artist. So I try to come up with new things only to see that my ideas are not so great, and the site I like really is great. Which is better, a gratuitous pretense of originality, or genuine respect and humility in the presence of excellence?
So the rule is to give credit where credit is due. It’s not plagiarism then; it’s attribution. If done well, it is to your credit.
(Thomas Edison, btw, was a first class bastard when it came to the latter point. A shame that someone so sharp had to demean himself that way.)
There is nothing wrong with mimicry as a way to learn. But when you’re the large company… and you’re competing with other large companies… stealing another company’s copy and design is a no no.
Yeah. I get that. I understand and totally agree. In the long run, you only trash your own rep (not to mention the expensive legal ramifications).
I once heard that when Toyota wanted to build a luxury brand, they bought all these Mercedes. Whole teams would spend weeks just studying things like how to get that certain exact feel to a door latch; thus, Lexus was born.
So digging in under the hood to find out how the hell they did that is one thing, but robbery is another. I guess that was I was getting at. There is an OK aspect, but as you and others have said, there is a black hat aspect.
BTW, I like the way I can easily see what I’m writing in the style of comment box you are using. (I’m gonna dig into that.)
I haven’t had any problems pertaining to me as a writer/author, but I did have a problem with my DJ business a few years ago. A DJ in Colorado had the bright idea of stealing some photos from my website and posting them on his website, showcasing them as though they were HIS clients dancing at parties. He even used one of them as the prominent on his home page and put, “ACTUAL CLIENTS,” under the photo. I was SO pissed off. He first told me that his “agent” bought them from a stock photo website, but then later told me to take a hike because the internet is a free domain. After three weeks of him not taking any action to remove my photos, I contacted the fraud division of his website hosting company, provided proof that the photos were mine, and they shut down his website. He was down for over a month, before he ended up with a new host. And my pictures were not on his new website.
I’ve also had two cases where other DJ’s copied the text on one of my pages, word for word.
That’s one of the best ways to handle it too. Contacting the fraud division, and having their site pulled down. I know a few people who go that route every single time.
Weird. I’ve used both softwares and Clicktale has enough differentiation that I wouldn’t think they’d need to replicate Crazy Egg’s copy and layout.
As you say, it’s also weird to me that they didn’t use their own software to come up with a more innovative design. As it see it, there’s a lot of different ways to test the page layout (and copy) on this so that it’s not so similar.
By the way, do you (or anyone else) know who designed the CrazyEgg home page? Was it Digital Telepathy? I ask because we got a portfolio the other day from some designers that said that they designed the Crazy Egg homepage and I wasn’t sure if it was legit.
I’m not sure, but I thought it was Digital Telepathy. Maybe that designer used to work with Digital Telepathy?
I’m a blogger but my full time job is teaching. Sharing and “stealing” ideas in teaching is common, but ripping off does happen. One teacher wants to outshine the rest so they will copycat a lesson for their evaluation another teacher has done or do the exact same lesson in the same way and take credit for it.
I can understand borrowing lesson plans. For some reason, to me, that’s not 100% ripping off to me because the lesson plan isnt really directly related to selling or competing (or maybe I know nothing about the teaching world? heh).
But when you have two competing companies… and one company takes copy from another… that’s just straight up bad.
As someone who is in the teaching world (doing an MA right now), I can tell you that it’s a simple matter of writing a letter and saying, “You mind if I use your syllabus as a starting point?”
Most academics will say, “Sure. You want any help?”
Not so sure a business guy would say the same thing…
That all depends on who’as asking for it, of course.
I think it’s ok to copy if it’s not your competition.
Tim Ferriss in the 4-Hour Work-Week writes:
How did I come up with the most successful BodyQUICK headline (“The Fastest Way to Increase Power and Speed Guaranteed”)? I borrowed it from the longest running, and thus most profitable, Rosetta Stone headline: “The Fastest Way to Learn a Language Guaranteed™” Reinventing the wheel is expensive— become an astute observer of what is already working and adapt it.
I used the title of my favorite Spanish book (Breaking Out Of Beginner Spanish) to inspire the title of my first knitting book: The Fearless Knitter: Breaking Out Of Beginner Knitting.
That’s not copying, to me. That’s adapting what works from one industry and taking it to another industry. When you’re a leading company, you shouldn’t really take designs from other companies within your niche. You’ll get found out real quick.
That’s what I mean – if it’s not your competition. You said it better – if it’s in another industry, it’s ok.
Stealing from one location = theft.
Stealing from many locations = the creative process.
I use ClickTale and visit their site regularly.
They were clearly trying to see see if a long-form sales page would work for them, and figured their competitors version obviously was working – so why not try it and see what results they’re getting?
I don’t agree with it, but I doubt it is a long-term strategy for them.
But that said, their page looks like crap and is a BLATANT rip.
I’m all for testing out new ideas… I built this entire Social Triggers websites as being a “conversion guy.”
And I regularly refer to classic sales letters for inspiration when writing copy.
However, what really annoys me about this, if they did copy, they didn’t even try to adapt it. They just copied the Johnson box copy… the bullets… and tweaked the headline slightly. It’s basically the same to me though.
I